no proven a relationship between their vaccine and immunity to the virus?

[ema-adama]

14.6 Immunogenicity
A relationship between antibody responses to RotaTeq and protection against rotavirus gastroenteritis has not been established. In phase 3 studies, 92.9% to 100% of 439 recipients of RotaTeq achieved a 3-fold or more rise in serum anti-rotavirus IgA after a three-dose regimen when compared to 12.3%-20.0%of 397 placebo recipients.From the product insert (http://www.google.co.il/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=1&ved=0CAYQFjAA&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.merck.com%2Fproduct%2Fusa%2F pi_circulars%2Fr%2Frotateq%2Frotateq_pi.pdf&rct=j&q=a+relationship+between+antibody+responses+to+Rot aTeq+against+rotavirus+gastroenteritis+has+not+bee n+established&ei=cwGKS4D3LpL00gTSnuXHCw&usg=AFQjCNHgUZxPpzA_sLqDZ-laCaBF92IyDw&sig2=np3A5Ueqn0bYhbATUy7OCg)

Bolding mine.

Is this relevant? Do the numbers that follow not indicate that in the study sample the vaccine is working? Admittedly, 836 babies is hardly a large study when it comes to making claims for the vaccine for millions of children.

I have not read much about this vaccine, so I have no idea if there have been more substantial studies done or not.

ETA: please fix the title for me by dropping the 'a'. Thanks

[Spy]

No proven relationship between antibodies and immunity. Vaccine 'works' in terms of changing symbols in your blood test results. But you can have the right symbols in your blood test results and still get sick with rotavirus :). After all, the point of vaccination as parents tend to perceive it, is to 'protect from disease', i.e. not get sick, not change the blood test numbers.

So the manufacturer here is saying - we don't know if you still get the disease, all we know is you are likely to develop antibodies shortly following vaccination (which you may do even without vaccination, just not as likely).

[Momtezuma Tuatara]

Here's another funny one about mumps:

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/28/nyregion/28critic.html?partner=rss&emc=rss (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/28/nyregion/28critic.html?partner=rss&emc=rss)

“People that have measurable antibodies (http://health.nytimes.com/health/guides/test/antibody-titer/overview.html?inline=nyt-classifier) to mumps, which I was always taught meant you were immune, we found are getting the disease,” said Dr. Edward Chapnick, director of infectious diseases (http://health.nytimes.com/health/guides/specialtopic/travelers-guide-to-avoiding-infectious-diseases/overview.html?inline=nyt-classifier) at Maimonides Medical Center.

[MinorityView]

They are doing so well with the vaccines...

15 or 20 doses of polio vaccine needed in Ghana

3 doses of MMR needed in NY

pretty soon people will be spending all their time getting vaccinated!

[ema-adama]

No proven relationship between antibodies and immunity. Vaccine 'works' in terms of changing symbols in your blood test results. But you can have the right symbols in your blood test results and still get sick with rotavirus :). After all, the point of vaccination as parents tend to perceive it, is to 'protect from disease', i.e. not get sick, not change the blood test numbers.

So the manufacturer here is saying - we don't know if you still get the disease, all we know is you are likely to develop antibodies shortly following vaccination (which you may do even without vaccination, just not as likely).
Thanks, that cleared that up for me somewhat. Essentially they are saying that antibodies are not indicative of protection. That message is not coming across quite so clearly.

My friend who gave her baby this vax was amazed at the diarrhoea that her son got when he had the vaccine. Diarrhoea that burnt his bum.

[ema-adama]

They are doing so well with the vaccines...

15 or 20 doses of polio vaccine needed in Ghana

3 doses of MMR needed in NY

pretty soon people will be spending all their time getting vaccinated!



Yeah - just like most farmers rely on someone to sell them seed for one planting season, we are growing to rely on someone to sell us immunity to disease, for a 'season' so to speak. Lucrative, but not in the interests of the consumer.
:gaah:

[MinorityView]

Yeah - just like most farmers rely on someone to sell them seed for one planting season, we are growing to rely on someone to sell us immunity to disease, for a 'season' so to speak. Lucrative, but not in the interests of the consumer.

That sounds like an interesting article. Hmmm.