Swine flu: Diagnosis and Treatment.

[Momtezuma Tuatara]

First diagnosis, which at the moment, appears to be tricky:

http://scienceblogs.com/effectmeasure/2009/04/latest_on_swine_flu_from_cdc.php



An emergency conference call for the Clinician Outreach and Communication Activity (COCA (http://www.bt.cdc.gov/coca/)) was announced just hours ago on the Clinicians Terrorism and Emergency Preparedness listserv. It was "live blogged" via the Comments Thread by reader Abigail, MD. Here's the gist (lightly edited), as typed by her in real time (thanks!):

.....

Question: Is there any explanation for the high fatality rate in mexico as opposed to US?

Answer: Don't know, but it is "quite a concern." "Current diagnostics... for seasonal influenza ... will not be able to tell you if individual has swine flu or seasonal flu." Thus it's hard to know how to treat patients with influenza symptoms in US, since swine flu is amantadine resistant and seasonal is resistant to Tamiflu.

[Momtezuma Tuatara]

Here is a thread in another forum I'm a member of:

http://www.curevents.com/vb/showthread.php?t=61445

[Momtezuma Tuatara]

The reason I go to this forum, is that it's a forum of thinkers. So don't expect answers on a platter. Do expect analysis and deep thinking.

Use of curcumin. http://www.curevents.com/vb/showthread.php?t=38166 (http://www.curevents.com/vb/showthread.php?t=38166)

http://www.curevents.com/vb/showthread.php?t=40238&highlight=turmeric+cytokine

Note this recipe here:

http://www.curevents.com/vb/showpost.php?p=299036&postcount=41

This is a thread on elderberry.

[Wonder-Full]

Thanks MT! I guess my main concern is what is it in the immunosuppressed that is the problem? I'm thinking it's the pneumonia but i'm not sure why pneumonia is more likely or is it that it's harder to fight off - I think I read that those with good Vitamin C intake are less likely to develop pneunomia? Anyway, I'll be reading the links later on this evening. Does the Flu have an incubation/transfer time when there are no symptoms present? All the preventatives talk about covering coughs/sneezes etc, but is that all that effective if the virus is transferring even before it's evident in the host?

BTW, had a few of ds's blood results back today and his Vit E is a bit low (he was 22) and the lowest on the norm range was 23 (Vit A was mid-range). So I need to see how this impacts things overall too.

[Momtezuma Tuatara]

His vitamin D will be more important.

http://www.lewrockwell.com/miller/miller25.html

[Wonder-Full]

Wow, thanks for that article! I was aware that Vit D was really important for us all, but that was interesting, particularly about autoimmune disorders being triggered by low Vit D. Not that I can find out now, but considering ds has 2 autoimmune conditions, I wonder if that played any part in it. I would be surprised if he was low though (I know the nephrotic syndrome caused his levels to drop severely) but who knows. Anyhow, it seems Vit D will be particularly important for him as a lifelong thing if he is to prevent other autoimmune conditions triggering (apparently he is at higher risk for diabetes just from having coeliacs already). At least he's in mid range for Vit D atm.

Now that I know he's not od'ing on Vit A I will resume a daily dose of CLO instead of the 2-3 times a week I dropped them down to over the past 6wks.

[Wonder-Full]

Off to get some cucurmin. Interestingly, I turned this up when doing my nephrotic syndrome research too as an anti-inflammatory. Now sounds the time to get it in case of relapse for that too...

Healthpost.co.nz have a range of different products.

[LovingMama]

Is it best to avoid public places? We had plans for Sea World on Friday in San Diego but if it's not a good idea we won't go. That and Old Town where they make tortillas by hand fresh.

[Momtezuma Tuatara]

It's best to avoid fear. Fear is by far a bigger killer than pathogens. If you want to go, go. Just do the sensible things. Keep your hands clean. Don't put fingers in mouths without thinking. Above all, be happy and relish every minute of it. Treat each day as a gift.

[Momtezuma Tuatara]

Wow, thanks for that article! I was aware that Vit D was really important for us all, but that was interesting, particularly about autoimmune disorders being triggered by low Vit D. Not that I can find out now, but considering ds has 2 autoimmune conditions, I wonder if that played any part in it. I would be surprised if he was low though (I know the nephrotic syndrome caused his levels to drop severely) but who knows. Anyhow, it seems Vit D will be particularly important for him as a lifelong thing if he is to prevent other autoimmune conditions triggering (apparently he is at higher risk for diabetes just from having coeliacs already). At least he's in mid range for Vit D atm.

Now that I know he's not od'ing on Vit A I will resume a daily dose of CLO instead of the 2-3 times a week I dropped them down to over the past 6wks.You don't need to supplement vitamin D. with your latitudes, so long as, in the winter, he gets outside between 12 and 2.00, you should be fine.

I got it wrong before, when I said those times applied to the summer. the brain must have scrambled with the eggs that morning.... In summer you can process vitamin D after 9 in the morning, and before 4 in the afternoon. But NOT in the winter... that time frame is narrowed right down. it's way safer to get your vitamin D from the sun, because the body controls the dose, and switches off, once it has enough. You can't do that with supplements.

In the winter my husband always sits on the doorstep for at least twenty minutes about 1.00. Always has done. And he's never had the flu.

[Wonder-Full]

OK, that's good to know. We had a good dose of time down at the beach today in that timeframe - shame it was cloudy and blustery though lol.

[Momtezuma Tuatara]

check the pdf attached to this post, just to make sure:

http://forums.beyondvaccination.com/showpost.php?p=6653&postcount=9

[LovingMama]

"It's best to avoid fear. Fear is by far a bigger killer than pathogens. If you want to go, go. Just do the sensible things. Keep your hands clean. Don't put fingers in mouths without thinking. Above all, be happy and relish every minute of it. Treat each day as a gift. "

Thank you, that was what I needed to hear. :) Always the best advice!

[Seaweed]

As a matter of interest, do sunbeds cause your body to produce vit D?

Also could you make your own curcumin with the 5 spice by adding tumeric root to the vodka as well?

[Momtezuma Tuatara]

Yes they do according to some people.. but are "dangerous" you know.

You could, but the problem with turmeric is that you have to eat a ton of it to make much of a difference.

You'd be dead drunk before you'd drunk enough.

funnily enough, alcoholics and smokers did quite well in the 1981 flu epidemic... :rolleyes:

Tis true.

[Seaweed]

:ROFL:Maybe I should just stock up on booze then. dh already thinks we are all going to die so at least I will be drunk enuf not to notice! I noticed something on the kindegarten notice board this avo from the health board about swine flu. It was saying about hand washing etc & had a section about vaxing. It said how the current flu vaccination for the season was over & it was not known if the flu vax had any effect on swine flu.

[Momtezuma Tuatara]

there is absolutely no protection for this combination virus whatsoever.

end of story.

[LovingMama]

So the best thing is to keep healthy, and be calm? What about moving away from highly populated areas?

[Momtezuma Tuatara]

the best thing is to keep healthy, calm and know what you're going to do when. Yes, moving away from highly populated areas is a good idea, particularly if you are wanting to grow your own stuff, or get away from the rat race, but every choice will have a down side. If you move away from areas where you can buy what you need easily, you will need to be a lot more self-sufficient...

which is a good thing actually...

[LovingMama]

The knowing what I'm going to do when is what gets me. I'm trying to put together a 72 hour emergency kit, and got the basics off the red cross site and a few others, but as what else to put in there I'm kinda lost.

And the steps that I need to take, I'm lost with that. Like if they do try if a virus is spreading quickly what steps should I take, and if they try to quaratine people in their homes, what are the steps I need to take?
Those are the things I would like to have planned out.It would definitely help me sleep better.

[Wonder-Full]

If it comes to being quarantined at home I'm guessing you'd need food, water, a means of heating/cooking for that time in case main service supply was cut due to either sick people or just every one needing to stay home and if automated services broke? No idea, worst case scenario I imagine. I've heard that it would be something like 10 days of quarantine to break through the cycle??

Not due to this issue, but as part of my normal emergency planning (for me it was Peak Oil that started me on the path towards self sufficiency while living in a town rather than owning land in the whops as well as the fact I live in "the big one" earthquake territory). I have enough food (boring for the most part) for about 2 mths (I do have freezer stuff, but this may not be the best idea if electricity goes down). I have a woodburner that heats and can be cooked on. We have a full bbq gas cyclinder for cooking. We have a large water tank built into our porch of our house that would be more than enough water for all needs including for watering the garden too as well as bottled water (I'm sure the tank wouldn't survive an earthquake lol). I have a vege garden and plenty of seeds on hand. I have first aid kit - both natural remedy type stuff as well as conventional.

Now I just sit back and continue as we were.

[LovingMama]

If it comes to being quarantined at home I'm guessing you'd need food, water, a means of heating/cooking for that time in case main service supply was cut due to either sick people or just every one needing to stay home and if automated services broke? No idea, worst case scenario I imagine. I've heard that it would be something like 10 days of quarantine to break through the cycle??

Not due to this issue, but as part of my normal emergency planning (for me it was Peak Oil that started me on the path towards self sufficiency while living in a town rather than owning land in the whops as well as the fact I live in "the big one" earthquake territory). I have enough food (boring for the most part) for about 2 mths (I do have freezer stuff, but this may not be the best idea if electricity goes down). I have a woodburner that heats and can be cooked on. We have a full bbq gas cyclinder for cooking. We have a large water tank built into our porch of our house that would be more than enough water for all needs including for watering the garden too as well as bottled water (I'm sure the tank wouldn't survive an earthquake lol). I have a vege garden and plenty of seeds on hand. I have first aid kit - both natural remedy type stuff as well as conventional.

Now I just sit back and continue as we were.

May I ask what you mean by "peak oil", and what kind of food do you have stored for 2 months. I don't shop regular grocery stores anymore, and really have nothing in my cupboard, and would love some suggestions on what to stock.

[Momtezuma Tuatara]

Once oil runs out, we are going to be living pretty much in 1800's times, so if that comes to reality, you are going to need a lot of the skills your great great grandparents once had.

We live in a country which has always advocated emergency provisions for earthquakes and the like. We'd be fine for quite some time, with the exception of milk, other than milk made from powder which sucks.

I'm also a member of various boards, which specialize in survival. The only problem with them, is that they are often crewed by people who are hysterical by nature, and see death and destruction under every bed. So I avoid certain threads, or forums, and only go to places which have practical advice.

America has huge numbers of those forums, so there's plenty to chose from.

One of the best known is http://www.timebomb2000.com/vb/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=9 but it's not necessarily one of the best. I don't know my way around most of them, because I've had my marbles in a row for a long time.

I'm not that keen on making this board a survival board, because that would be reinventing the wheel that others have already invented :D.

[Wonder-Full]

I also stay aware from the "grab ya gun and head for the hills" type boards too MT. Yeah, so many out there to get info about all of this. Scarily, most of the people on those boards *want* TSTHTF so they can go shoot all the zombies. *shudder* In fact I don't read any peak oil stuff anymore coz I feel i've prepared all I can and just carry on with life as it is for now.

Anyway, here is a nice positive action list of things you can do to get prepared for no matter what may happen.

http://sharonastyk.com/resources2/100-things-you-can-do-to-get-ready-for-peak-oil2/

As for food - just to keep it short - I only put food in my emergency bin that is food that we eat on a day-to-day basis. Food that I can easily cycle through the house as it approaches expiry and replace (peanut butter, pasta, rice, popcorn, tinned food etc). I keep a list of what's in there with it's expiry date next to it and have the food in order so I can just pull off the top what needs eating.

[Momtezuma Tuatara]

I also stay aware from the "grab ya gun and head for the hills" type boards too MT. Yeah, so many out there to get info about all of this. Scarily, most of the people on those boards *want* TSTHTF so they can go shoot all the zombies. *shudder* In fact I don't read any peak oil stuff anymore coz I feel i've prepared all I can and just carry on with life as it is for now.

Yeah. sigh. :shakes head:


Anyway, here is a nice positive action list of things you can do to get prepared for no matter what may happen.

http://sharonastyk.com/resources2/100-things-you-can-do-to-get-ready-for-peak-oil2/

As for food - just to keep it short - I only put food in my emergency bin that is food that we eat on a day-to-day basis. Food that I can easily cycle through the house as it approaches expiry and replace (peanut butter, pasta, rice, popcorn, tinned food etc). I keep a list of what's in there with it's expiry date next to it and have the food in order so I can just pull off the top what needs eating.

That's a good list. Very very good.

[Wonder-Full]

Here are the original two preparation lists found elsewhere and sorted differently (but by the same author). I prefer these for layout - maybe just coz these were the ones I first read (and came at a time when I was wondering what the heck to do instead of hearing the doom and gloom).

http://www.groovygreen.com/groove/?p=2270 (http://www.groovygreen.com/groove/?p=2270)

http://www.groovygreen.com/groove/?p=2271 (http://www.groovygreen.com/groove/?p=2271)

Anyway, that's enough thread-jacking from me...